Is Lewis Hamilton the best driver in F1?

[MGROVERnut]

Originally Posted by MalcQV

You are right in your first statement. He may say he is a McLaren driver but when he wins another one or two WDC's (and Hamilton is easily good enough to do that) and the team that most drivers consider in F1 to be the ultimate then just quite possibly he will forget his allegiance to McLaren. Then there is the money on offer at Ferrari. I suspect he will go to Ferrari at some point of what will be a very successful career.

Not sure. It's kind of like saying Steven Gerrard will play for Man U next season.... Would Hamilton leave what he may almost now consider his family? He may want to make himself as synomous with Mclaren as Enzo was with Ferrari....

[MGROVERnut]

Originally Posted by Dean Carr

Seriously mate do something more with your life. You're miles off every time.

Forget Hamilton for a minute just look at those stats I posted earlier and explain why you rate Alonso so highly.

I think the guy is well over rated and those numbers seem to prove it.

[Randyjim]

Originally Posted by MGROVERnut

He may want to make himself as synomous with Mclaren as Enzo was with Ferrari....

What by rebranding the team with his own name. Don't be such a daft ****!

I really cant imagine being able to buy a 200mph (Lewis) Hamilton MPC15. An (Enzo) Ferrari Enzo on the other hand? Hmm, that would be cool.

[soj]

Originally Posted by MalcQV

You are right in your first statement. He may say he is a McLaren driver but when he wins another one or two WDC's (and Hamilton is easily good enough to do that) and the team that most drivers consider in F1 to be the ultimate then just quite possibly he will forget his allegiance to McLaren. Then there is the money on offer at Ferrari. I suspect he will go to Ferrari at some point of what will be a very successful career.

No chance, he is McLaren through and through, it's simply never going to happen. Anyway the only team who have (and still are) any consistent competition to Ferrari in the last 30 odd years have been McLaren.
McLaren don't have as much history as Ferrari but they are getting there. Ferrari have the backing of FIAT spa. so they will continue to lavish money on F1 but that does not mean they are the apple of everyone's eye.

Originally Posted by Randyjim

What by rebranding the team with his own name. Don't be such a daft ****!

I really cant imagine being able to buy a 200mph (Lewis) Hamilton MPC15. An (Enzo) Ferrari Enzo on the other hand? Hmm, that would be cool.

The fact that you put Lewis in brackets would indicate that you are ridiculing the suggestion, i don't agree with MGRovernut on this ( Hamilton rebranding the team ) point but a similarly performing car to an Enzo, with any name would be cool, even if it were Skoda, Wartburg or VAZ never mind say lotus which would be really really cool! maybe even a Briatore F-B CB1 ??
I think he meant as (should be Sir) Ron Dennis has at McLaren.

Originally Posted by MGROVERnut

Forget Hamilton for a minute just look at those stats I posted earlier and explain why you rate Alonso so highly.

I think the guy is well over rated and those numbers seem to prove it.

Facts and figures don't prove anything........when the observer has, a) a complete dislike for one chap which seems at times to almost border on hatred. b) already made up his or her mind anyway.

[MalcQV]

I guess only time will tell whether Lewis is tempted by Ferrari or another team but he probably will move away from McLaren. They may be his 'family' and I know Ron Dennis funded him (though I suspect only because he had obvious talent) but equally McLaren need drivers like Lewis Hamilton so he owes them nothing.

soj, your last comment regarding hatred, well I agree that applies to certain teams too.
I will never likely be a McLaren fan or Renault or RB etc.

[Dean Carr]

Originally Posted by MGROVERnut

Forget Hamilton for a minute just look at those stats I posted earlier and explain why you rate Alonso so highly.

I think the guy is well over rated and those numbers seem to prove it.

Please just stop you are embarrassing yourself no end!

[MGROVERnut]

Originally Posted by Dean Carr

Please just stop you are embarrassing yourself no end!

You can't back Alonso with stats. Proves my points about him and it's becoming even more obvious this year.

[MGROVERnut]

Originally Posted by soj

Facts and figures don't prove anything........when the observer has, a) a complete dislike for one chap which seems at times to almost border on hatred. b) already made up his or her mind anyway.

From Wikipedia

Alonso stats:

Wins - 23
Podiums - 57
Races - 151
Career average = 1 win every 6.5 races

Hamilton stats:
Wins - 13
Podiums - 33
Races - 63
Career average = 1 win every 4.8 races

Senna stats:
wins - 41
Podiums - 80
Races - 162
Career average = 1 win every 3.9 races

Schumacher's career average is 1 win to every 2.8 races....

Once you actually factor age and experience in then some of those numbers get even tighter. Alonso had a few bad season at Renault, but then Hamilton had a bad year last year, so it all average out in the end...

[MGJohn]

Originally Posted by Dean Carr

Please just stop you are embarrassing yourself no end!

If he has he's had a good tutor...

Pot Black Kettle comes to mind ..



I think you should join the River Police Dean, as obviously you can walk on water ..


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S P L A DOOOSH!

There again, maybe not...
.

[Dean Carr]

Originally Posted by MGROVERnut

From Wikipedia

Alonso stats:

Wins - 23
Podiums - 57
Races - 151
Career average = 1 win every 6.5 races

Hamilton stats:
Wins - 13
Podiums - 33
Races - 63
Career average = 1 win every 4.8 races

Senna stats:
wins - 41
Podiums - 80
Races - 162
Career average = 1 win every 3.9 races

Schumacher's career average is 1 win to every 2.8 races....

Once you actually factor age and experience in then some of those numbers get even tighter. Alonso had a few bad season at Renault, but then Hamilton had a bad year last year, so it all average out in the end...

Hamilton had half a season in a bad car during the entire 4 years career. Alonso had 4 years alone in bad cars. Get your facts straight.

[Dean Carr]

Originally Posted by MGJohn

If he has he's had a good tutor...

Pot Black Kettle comes to mind ..



I think you should join the River Police Dean, as obviously you can walk on water ..


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S P L A DOOOSH!

There again, maybe not...
.

I think we can all see whose at the end of the jokes

[soj]

Originally Posted by Dean Carr

Hamilton had half a season in a bad car during the entire 4 years career. Alonso had 4 years alone in bad cars. Get your facts straight.

Which cars?
Taken fromhttp://www.fernandoalonso.com/en/about_fernando a site i feel sure people are familiar with
.......And in 2003 Fernando became the youngest driver to win a Grand Prix: in Hungary, at the age of 22. His record for the season included one victory, two poles and four podium finishes, giving him sixth place in the championship.
In 2004 Fernando did not win any races, but racked up more points than the previous year and also achieved one of the best starts ever, finishing third in the US Grand Prix having been ninth on the grid.
In 2005 Fernando finally won the coveted World Championship. His stats for the season were spectacular: seven wins, six polls and 15 podiums. 2005 was another year in which Fernando made history: as the first Spaniard to become World Cup champion, as well as being the youngest winner ever.
His country of birth was also keen to honour his achievement, in the form of the Prince of Asturias Award for Sport.
In 2006 Fernando was once again world champion, this time clinching the title in a thrilling final race. His tally for the season provides further proof of a born champion: seven wins, six polls, fourteen podium places.
In 2007 Fernando Alonso signed for the McLaren team, racing in the MP4/22 car with which he achieved third place in the World Championship. The figures speak for themselves: four victories, two poles and 12 podium finishes.
In 2008 Fernando decided to return to his first home: Renault. There he achieved a fifth-place finish in the World Championship, with two victories and three podium finishes.
In 2009 Fernando stayed at Renault for a further season with a car, the R29, which did not prove as competitive as hoped. One pole position and one podium finish were enough to give the Asturian driver ninth place, and although it was not his finest year, his racing was of a high standard.
2010 is a key year in the career of Fernando Alonso, with his move to a legendary name in Formula One: Ferrari. On his debut with the Italian team in pre-season testing in Valencia, Fernando was fastest for the day, and his first Grand Prix went like a dream. In Bahrain he started from third on the grid before racing to victory.
2010 could most certainly prove a great year for Fernando, with the combination of the top team and the top driver offering the promise of great success.


The Renault? yes in 2009 that was a poor car. If a site like this only mentions one uncompettative year/car then i doubt there are any more, they aren't going to be critical of him are they.
In the other years? that engine, no in fact the whole package it's so poor i don't know why they bother*

Put in any way you like Deanando you aint got the facts to back it up chap

[MGROVERnut]

Actually I won't deny Alonso has had at least 2 seasons with rubbish cars, maybe almost 3 but I won't go as far a 4. F1 is partly about making good decisions. Leaving a top team in Mclaren was a bad decision. No one made him go. He left because Mclaren weren't willing to treat Hamilton like Renault treated Trulli and Ferrari treat Massa.

Read the Jarno Trulli wiki and the section 2002 - 2004:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarno_Trulli

Some highlights: The 2003 car was really strong ...and Trulli left the team feeling Renault unfairly favoured Alonso..... I bet Massa can relate to that.....

Also Alonso has had a much better car than Mclaren this season. Yet he's nowhere in the WC! How can you defend that?

As for Hamilton he's had 2 bad cars. One last year and one this year. The fact that he's leading the WC with the third fastest car on the grid speaks volumes.

[Randyjim]

If it's necessary to differentiate between results in good cars, and results in bad cars, then the only time an accurate comparison can be made is when both drivers were in the same car. Alternatively all results that were achieved in good cars and bad cars should be discounted. How many World Titles do the record books show Schumacher has if we do that?

Of course, people could just have opinions, but then we wouldn't be able to bikker about the facts would we.

[Dean Carr]

Originally Posted by Randyjim

If it's necessary to differentiate between results in good cars, and results in bad cars, then the only time an accurate comparison can be made is when both drivers were in the same car. Alternatively all results that were achieved in good cars and bad cars should be discounted. How many World Titles do the record books show Schumacher has if we do that?

Of course, people could just have opinions, but then we wouldn't be able to bikker about the facts would we.

Completely agree, it's paradox where it seems easy to compare two drivers on results, but when you get down to it there seems to be more ambiguity and comparisons seems idiotic.

I guess the only real way of comparing two drivers is on who you personally believe is better, I 100% feel Alonso is the fastest, most determined and matured driver currently racing. And this is backed up with what the grid actually believe. To make mgroverNUT feel better, I believe Hamilton is the most polished driver, his style is extremely refined, where I see Hamilton coming out of Eau Rouge and heading down to Les Combes the car moves fluidly whereas Alonso just heads for the corner. Hamilton is able to keep this fluidity through an entire race with speed. The difference between them two is that Alonso always seems the stronger horse given the car he is in. I trust his ability to get what's possible out of the car more than I do Hamilton. Given more time and an attitude readjustment I'll probably start to trust Hamilton more. But alas, Alonso is currently the big dog for me